Called custr service to place an order. The person who answered was probably in another country-a call center?? I used to speak with a “Maine-LLBean employee”. The shorts I ordered were theoretically identical to those I had ordered for the past 30 years. Two pair cost$60 each and had no liners. Rather than having the LLBean logo stitched on them, it was printed. Tightening the belt was difficult as it keeps slipping. I’ve bought from LLBean for 30-40 years as did my father. Quality standards have slipped BADLY! A real disappointment!!